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 Post subject: Re: How to Stop Bird Flu
PostPosted: 2005-10-29 19:02:07
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Joined: 2005-10-29 19:02:07
On Sat, 29 Oct 2005 15:02:18 +0100, Michael Saunby
wrote:

>See
>http://www.fao.org/newsroom/en/news/2005/108298/index.html
>
>28 October 2005, Rome - The continuous spread of the deadly avian influenza
>virus H5N1 in countries outside southeast Asia confirms FAOs warning that
>bird flu is an international problem that requires a global response.
>
>The virus is currently spreading westwards along the flyways of wild birds
>and it has arrived at the front door of European countries. We can expect
>that it will reach the Middle East and countries in Africa in the very near
>future.
>
>The current bird flu scenario should not cause panic and fear; instead it
>calls for rational and immediate action to fight the disease at its origin ?
>that means in animals.
>...
>
>The Food and Agriculture Organization of the UN and the World Organisation
>for Animal Health have developed a detailed global strategy for the control
>of avian influenza in animals and have calculated the cost of implementation
>at about $175 million U.S., to support surveillance, diagnosis and other
>control measures, including vaccination. We are still facing a serious
>funding gap and have only received around $30 million U.S. to date from
>Germany, Japan, the Netherlands, Switzerland and the United States.
>
>Countries at risk and the international community need to act rapidly to
>control avian influenza at source in animals. We cannot afford to wait to
>battle the disease in pharmacies and hospitals, but need to get rid of the
>virus in affected farmers backyards.
>
>Prevention will be cheaper than the cure.
>
>
>


Big Deal! Scientists looking for a new gravy train :-(

How long has the disease been in Asia with only 60 odd deaths?

2 - 3 years?

Youre more likely to be hit by a bus than die from AF.


Angus Macmillan
www.roots-of-blood.org.uk
www.killhunting.org
www.con-servation.org.uk


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 Post subject: Re: How to Stop Bird Flu
PostPosted: 2005-10-29 21:21:15
Online
Registered User

Joined: 2005-10-29 21:21:15
On Sat, 29 Oct 2005 18:13:32 GMT, S. Maizlich
wrote:

>amacmil304@aol.com wrote:
>> On Sat, 29 Oct 2005 03:58:32 GMT, S. Maizlich
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>So I ask you again.
>>>>
>>>>Where is that evidence?
>>>
>>>IMMEDIATELY below your name, Angie.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Angus Macmillan
>>>>www.roots-of-blood.org.uk <--- Here!
>>>>www.killhunting.org <--- And here!
>>>>www.con-servation.org.uk <--- And here!
>>
>>
>>
>> Rubbish!
>
>Your ideologically founded opinions? They certainly are!
>
>
>> These sites have absolutely nothing to do with factory
>> farming
>
>What they demonstrate is your affiliation and reliance
>on polemical, ideological, ANTI-science sources.
>Therefore, your views about factory farming are based
>on polemical, ideological ANTI-science.
>
>In other words, youre an ignorant twat concerning
>factory farming, and in particular concerning its
>relation (NONE) to the bird flu outbreak.

Really. You dont have much of a clue :-)

When I ask you for sceintific evidence that bird flu is not connected
to factory type farming you fly off at a tangent by saying that my
views are ideological, but cant give any scientific evidence that Im
wrong.

On top of all that you keep referring to my website links which have
nothing to do with factory farming.

Perhaps a course of logic would be of benefit to you or some form of
psychiatric treatment to settle your mind.

You seem quite confused.

Angus Macmillan
www.roots-of-blood.org.uk
www.killhunting.org
www.con-servation.org.uk


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 Post subject: Re: How to Stop Bird Flu
PostPosted: 2005-10-30 02:04:08
Online
Registered User

Joined: 2005-10-30 02:04:08
>
> When I ask you for sceintific evidence that bird flu is not connected
> to factory type farming you fly off at a tangent by saying that my
> views are ideological, but cant give any scientific evidence that Im
> wrong.
>
> On top of all that you keep referring to my website links which have
> nothing to do with factory farming.
>
> Perhaps a course of logic would be of benefit to you or some form of
> psychiatric treatment to settle your mind.

Talking about logic, please explain how does one prove a negative?


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 Post subject: Re: How to Stop Bird Flu
PostPosted: 2005-10-30 03:56:31
Online
Registered User

Joined: 2005-10-30 03:56:31
amacmil304@aol.com wrote:
> On Sat, 29 Oct 2005 18:13:32 GMT, S. Maizlich
> wrote:
>
>
>>amacmil304@aol.com wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 29 Oct 2005 03:58:32 GMT, S. Maizlich
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>So I ask you again.
>>>>>
>>>>>Where is that evidence?
>>>>
>>>>IMMEDIATELY below your name, Angie.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Angus Macmillan
>>>>>www.roots-of-blood.org.uk <--- Here!
>>>>>www.killhunting.org <--- And here!
>>>>>www.con-servation.org.uk <--- And here!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Rubbish!
>>
>>Your ideologically founded opinions? They certainly are!
>>
>>
>>
>>>These sites have absolutely nothing to do with factory
>>>farming
>>
>>What they demonstrate is your affiliation and reliance
>>on polemical, ideological, ANTI-science sources.
>>Therefore, your views about factory farming are based
>>on polemical, ideological ANTI-science.
>>
>>In other words, youre an ignorant twat concerning
>>factory farming, and in particular concerning its
>>relation (NONE) to the bird flu outbreak.
>
>
> Really. You dont have much of a clue

Much more than a clue.


> When I ask you for sceintific evidence that bird flu is not connected
> to factory type farming

...you are committing a logical fallacy: shifting the
burden of proof. I dont play your fallacy games, Angie.

YOU seem to believe there is a link between factory
farming and avian flu. The burden of proof is on you.
Prove that there is a link.


> On top of all that you keep referring to my website links which have
> nothing to do with factory farming.

But they have EVERYTHING to do with how you form your
opinions. Those sites are inflammatory, extremist,
anti-intellectual sites, and you proudly include links
to them in every vapid post you make. I conclude that
your thinking, in everything, lacks any scientific
rigor at all. Furthermore, you commit a massive and
fatal logical fallacy: demanding that I *disprove*
your implied claim (that factory farming is linked to
avian flu), when the burden of proof is on you to show
there IS a link.

You really are a stupid twit, Angie.


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 Post subject: Re: How to Stop Bird Flu
PostPosted: 2005-10-30 17:42:29
Online
Registered User

Joined: 2005-10-30 17:42:29
wrote in message
news:vvd7m15rccbctlcfv11s0bqb1ra0qq5u45@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 29 Oct 2005 15:02:18 +0100, Michael Saunby
> wrote:
>
>>See
>>http://www.fao.org/newsroom/en/news/2005/108298/index.html
>>
>>28 October 2005, Rome - The continuous spread of the deadly avian
>>influenza
>>virus H5N1 in countries outside southeast Asia confirms FAOs warning that
>>bird flu is an international problem that requires a global response.
>>
>>The virus is currently spreading westwards along the flyways of wild birds
>>and it has arrived at the front door of European countries. We can expect
>>that it will reach the Middle East and countries in Africa in the very
>>near
>>future.
>>
>>The current bird flu scenario should not cause panic and fear; instead it
>>calls for rational and immediate action to fight the disease at its origin
>>?
>>that means in animals.
>>...
>>
>>The Food and Agriculture Organization of the UN and the World Organisation
>>for Animal Health have developed a detailed global strategy for the
>>control
>>of avian influenza in animals and have calculated the cost of
>>implementation
>>at about $175 million U.S., to support surveillance, diagnosis and other
>>control measures, including vaccination. We are still facing a serious
>>funding gap and have only received around $30 million U.S. to date from
>>Germany, Japan, the Netherlands, Switzerland and the United States.
>>
>>Countries at risk and the international community need to act rapidly to
>>control avian influenza at source in animals. We cannot afford to wait to
>>battle the disease in pharmacies and hospitals, but need to get rid of the
>>virus in affected farmers backyards.
>>
>>Prevention will be cheaper than the cure.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> Big Deal! Scientists looking for a new gravy train :-(
>
> How long has the disease been in Asia with only 60 odd deaths?
>

Human deaths. Presumably you dont care about the poultry, the wildlife,
or the farming livliehoods affected?

What am I saying. Of course you dont, youre Angus Macmillan, your only
concern is that your taxes are never spent helping others.


> 2 - 3 years?
>
> Youre more likely to be hit by a bus than die from AF.
>

Indeed I am. Presumably youre now working as a bus driver.

Michael Saunby


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 Post subject: Re: How to Stop Bird Flu
PostPosted: 2005-10-31 09:11:00
Online
Registered User

Joined: 2005-10-31 09:11:00
suspicious minds wrote in message
news:sSV8f.8101$iZ4.3954@newsfe2-gui.ntli.net...
>
> >
> > When I ask you for sceintific evidence that bird flu is not connected
> > to factory type farming you fly off at a tangent by saying that my
> > views are ideological, but cant give any scientific evidence that Im
> > wrong.
> >
> > On top of all that you keep referring to my website links which have
> > nothing to do with factory farming.
> >
> > Perhaps a course of logic would be of benefit to you or some form of
> > psychiatric treatment to settle your mind.
>
> Talking about logic, please explain how does one prove a negative?
>
>

By proof of a positive which renders the negative impossible. For example,
if I were to say I was not at location X at time Y (a negative), and was
able to prove I was at location Z at time Y, then I would have proved my
original negative statement (unless I could be in two places at once, of
course). If there had been a reliable witness at location X at time Y, of
course, there might also have been direct evidence of the truth of my
negative statement.

So, in the case Angus has been arguing about, one would need to ascertain
whether there had been any link established between factory farming and
known outbreaks of avian flu. That might not be 100% proof, either way, but
itd be the best evidence currently available

Bird flu might not be connected with factory type farming at the moment, but
if it ever reaches the UK, keeping birds in buildings which are secure from
wild bird access, and exercising careful bio security could be vital to
keeping the disease under control.


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 Post subject: Re: How to Stop Bird Flu
PostPosted: 2005-10-31 13:50:55
Online
Registered User

Joined: 2005-10-31 13:50:55
On Sat, 29 Oct 2005 15:02:18 +0100, Michael Saunby
wrote:

>See
>http://www.fao.org/newsroom/en/news/2005/108298/index.html
>
>28 October 2005, Rome - The continuous spread of the deadly avian influenza
>virus H5N1 in countries outside southeast Asia confirms FAOs warning that
>bird flu is an international problem that requires a global response.
>
>The virus is currently spreading westwards along the flyways of wild birds
>and it has arrived at the front door of European countries. We can expect
>that it will reach the Middle East and countries in Africa in the very near
>future.
>
>The current bird flu scenario should not cause panic and fear; instead it
>calls for rational and immediate action to fight the disease at its origin ?
>that means in animals.
>...
>
>The Food and Agriculture Organization of the UN and the World Organisation
>for Animal Health have developed a detailed global strategy for the control
>of avian influenza in animals and have calculated the cost of implementation
>at about $175 million U.S., to support surveillance, diagnosis and other
>control measures, including vaccination. We are still facing a serious
>funding gap and have only received around $30 million U.S. to date from
>Germany, Japan, the Netherlands, Switzerland and the United States.
>
>Countries at risk and the international community need to act rapidly to
>control avian influenza at source in animals. We cannot afford to wait to
>battle the disease in pharmacies and hospitals, but need to get rid of the
>virus in affected farmers backyards.
>
>Prevention will be cheaper than the cure.

Yep. Go veggie.


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